Nigeria: My Concerns About Next President, APC – Esele

Peter Esele was president of the Trade Union Congress (TUC) and now a chieftain of All Progressives Congress (APC). In this interview with Chibuzo Ukaibe, he speaks on the state of his party and the dynamics of the political space ahead of the 2023 election.

Presidential aspirants have been meeting key power brokers across the country. What kind of issues do you think such power brokers should look out for when engaging with these aspirants?

We have not been able to define our presidents over the years. We don’t know whether they are rightists or leftists; liberals or center left or center right. How do you know where a president or leader stands? It has to do with the person’s track record and beliefs. So the first thing is to define where the person stands. So as much as we have not had presidents that are defined in that sense, we have also not had political parties that are defined.

So, the first challenge is what do these political parties represent? Let me make an open disclosure at this point, I’m a card carrying member of APC but it doesn’t make me a politician because I do not occupy a political office.

As a progressives inclined person, I started from the defunct ACN which merged with other parties to become APC because of its progressives tendencies. PDP is a conservative platform. But what we have now are individuals who govern by what they believe and not by what the party manifesto is. A country cannot survive on individual development.

For instance, when Obasanjo was president, it was all about Obasanjo, not PDP. Same applied for Umaru Musa Yar’adua and Goodluck Jonathan. Now we have Buhari and it’s still about Buhari, not APC. No society develops that way. So power brokers will first of all ask them to define their party, your party should define you and not you define the party, so when the party defines you, you now become a president that will carry out the details of the party.

No matter how you feel about Donald Trump, he carried out the manifestos of the Republican party that is why till tomorrow he has more than 80% Republicans on his side. He was focused on less government, less taxes, American interest first, closed borders, tough on immigration, and so on. These are things the Republican party is known for, therefore Donald Trump enjoys everything about the Republican party.

Now let’s come to Joe Biden. You can see that he is presiding based on the ideology of the Democratic Party. So we see more government role in the people’s lives, relaxed immigration policy, more money in the pockets of the citizens, affordable health care and so on.

You can differentiate both parties and you can see their president’s carrying out the dictates of the party. That is fundamental.

So, powerbrokers should demand that aspirants convince them on what their parties represent. We used to have those parties in the past. We had UPN, NPN, GNPP and they are all defined with clear cut manifestos.

We don’t have this any more which makes it so easy for a governor to be APC in the morning and by afternoon he is either APGA or PDP. That’s where we are right now.

When these issues are well defined, power brokers can now ask the aspirants questions on the development of critical structures in the country in line with his or her party’s ideology ranging from oil and gas to banking, healthcare, transportation and unity and security of the country among others. Whatever the president says must be in his party manifesto. Our next president must not be a generalist on critical issues as we have had over time. We need a president that is a specialist on issues, he has to be clear on what he or she wants to do in line with his party manifesto.

I expect power brokers should ascertain whether or not they want to be president for the sake of the office. I say this because the President of Nigeria is one of the most powerful presidents in the world. He is easily among the 10 top most powerful presidents. So our leaders must be able to define that.

We don’t want powerful presidents and governors anymore. We just want a president that will follow the constitution. I don’t want a northern president nor a southern president. I want a Nigerian northerner as a president or Nigerian southerner as a president.

I believe in Nigeria, no matter the challenges. I think we are better together than being apart. But some politicians from all parts of the country are busy devaluing us because that’s what will make them get the office but they forget that if there is a crisis in the land they will have no country to govern.

You have pointed out the ideology crisis in our political system which requires a lot of orientation and reorientation. But do you think such a radical change is feasible between now and that time of the election, considering the seemingly over monetised politics we practice here?

Yes it can be breached. Politics all over the world is all about money. Nobody has raised more money than Barack Obama in the United States. He raised billions of dollars. So money is clearly involved in politics all over the world. The question you should ask is where are our politicians getting the monies from? You can still trace where Obama got all the money from. But it’s hard to trace where our politicians got theirs from, especially those who have tasted power and have used that power in getting much money. But we need someone who believes in principle, politicians all the world are the same, whether in Europe or America or Nigeria, they are self serving, driven by self interest and they care about themselves. But the difference between politicians in the US and the ones in Nigeria is that politicians in Europe or the US go for what I call enlightened self interest. It doesn’t mean they don’t have self interest after all every human being is naturally selfish. For instance, if you have a president that says no freedom of press, as a journalist, you will fight it because you want to be free and to make your organisation have the opportunity to exist and guarantee your job. So that’s what I call enlightened self interest. It is no longer seen as selfish because it’s for the good of the whole even though it starts from your own interest. Politicians in Europe or the US know that for there to be peace and for them to continue to enjoy, they must ensure that everybody is okay. That’s why they are able to create a society that is structured based on law.

But that is not the case in Nigeria so far because most of our politicians are still primitive in their wealth accumulation. They have a mindset of gathering today because they don’t know what will happen tomorrow and because of that belief they refuse to cater for the future generation. The effect of that is Boko Haram, banditry and most criminal activities across the country. Sadly most politicians hardly go to their constituencies during weekends. However I believe it is possible to cause a change in orientation between now and 2023. We need to task ourselves and those who want to be president on how to address the drift happening in the society? What are your plans or what have you designed for them? It takes self enlightened interest to know that it’s absolute madness for one to think that he or she will want to have peace in Nigeria and there is no peace in the north. It’s a matter of time before the south will start feeling it because of the migration that will come southward so to think that because you are in the south and so it doesn’t concern you what is happening in the north, is wrong. What we need are people who can design a framework to achieve it. They can say we can’t do it over night but we can sow the seed. Whether it is PDP or APC, we seem to have missed golden opportunities and that’s why we continue to miss them. But I still believe that it’s possible. We just need somebody who is defined such that I can look you in the face and say this is what this man can do. That’s how you develop a country. Also the future of this country rests with the youths and Nigerian youths are smart, intelligent and savvy.

A number of people have indicated interest to run for the 2023 presidency. Have you seen any one yet that can take Nigeria in the direction that you just spoke of?

Not everybody who wants to be president will be president, Someone can say I want to be president meanwhile he has no structure. He is not known beyond his local government or state. Others might just be paper tigers. It is one thing to say I want to be president and it’s another thing to be prepared for it. But the president we should be looking for now is a president that can hold the country together because we need to do have a country first. The president should be able to guarantee our security. A president that will hold us together. Then I think we will be seeing a quality leader, a world class leader, I think that will happen in anther 12years, thats the next 3 or 4 electoral circle.

Have you seen that particular person who can execute this task of keeping the country together in the area of those who have indicated interest in the presidential election?

I am not going to say I have seen the person right now but what I want to do is to hear them talk.

You might have some people in mind that he would be able to do this or that. But it’s also possible that you are overrating the person. So I am just looking for somebody who can hold this country together, who can defend and protect our country and chase out those who want to divide this country. Across the south there is kidnapping going on, people are afraid to even go home so its not only in the North.

I just need a president who will guaranntee security for my brother’s in the north, the south and all Nigerians.

What would you say to Nigerians who argue that your party, APC, has failed to ensure security, improve the economy and fight corruption which are the three cardinal things it ran on?

Everybody is entitled to their opinion. I told you I’m a card carrying member of APC. I am not a spokesperson for APC. In the last six years has the party been fantastic, I will not say so. But there was a president that once said that even if you bring one spiritual leader to be president of Nigeria that’s going to be very difficult for the person, because our problem is systemic. So it doesn’t matter who comes next year, that’s why I say the first thing is providing security, you have to deal with the systemic issues.

But critics accuse your party of being more interested in power acquisition than understanding the dynamics of Nigeria’s problem as of 2015?

But you can also see that the party or the president has been able to deal with some aspects of our problems. Government is continuous, there are areas you can give credit to them. There are other areas they should have done far better like the issue of security. For example, I would have loved to see more checks and balances in the way arms are purchased. You used one word reorientation. It’s something that is affecting every single Nigerian in the sense that immediately the majority of us get into office, the first thing we start thinking of is what can I get for myself, forgetting that you can’t survive if it’s only yourself. With regards to corruption, is it the best that the party could have done? The answer is No! The party could have done better. Another aspect is what happens at the state level. Nobody talks about what the governor’s are supposed to be doing. Areas where you can hold the federal government responsible are insecurity, foreign affairs and economy. I will say there is more that needs to be done but we must also hold governor’s and local government chairmen accountable as well.

Looking at your party. How would you access the way the party management so far in light of the upheavals arising from the convention so far?

This is happening because of interests. Nigerian politicians don’t like to do things the right way, it’s not just about APC. I saw it in PDP as well. I have said this again that Nigerian politicians don’t like to do things the right way, we always like cutting corners. In other parts of the world, two years before convention you already know the state that they will do the convention as well as the venue. You know the delegates that will be voting in that convention. But because we are used to cutting corners and not doing things the right way that’s why we are where we are. And that’s why this country is crawling while it is supposed to be running. Do I share with you the view that this is the best way that they are handling the convention, No! I do not share that view.

Do you have a preferred candidate for national chairman of APC?

No! I don’t have a preferred candidate. I don’t even know who the candidates are. I don’t even have an idea of what they are all coming to offer. I am not an illiterate voter, that’s why I went to school.

But they have been engaging the press and putting out their positions?

Before you put out a position, what have they done? Most people are not asking questions.

Do you fear for the APC in 2023?

I don’t fear for anything. I’m only interested in who will give the country that space to dream. I want to have a country that will give my children a sense of belonging and they can be the very best they want to be. I am not afraid for any party. APC will sort themselves out. If they can’t sort themselves out then they will face the consequences. I just want to have a country I can be proud of. Politicians in other countries go home. I don’t hold a political office, I only told you I am a card carrying member of APC. So it’s those who hold political offices who have to go home and majority of those holding political office today can never leave the kind of life they are living outside of government. That’s why each time you see that when they get close to the cliff they pull back. If APC or PDP don’t do the right thing they will soon become history. Nigeria is bigger than any individual or any party. My own take for 2023 is that I need a president who guarantees the security of this country, irrespective of where the person is from.

By Leadership.